Amiracle wet/dry trickle filter

IanB

Member
Jul 21, 2011
370
0
16
Mid_Suffolk, UK
www.oldschoolmtb.co.uk
Inherited one of these with my tank, it's 24" x 12" x 14"



Anyone know owt about their effectiveness?
If they are any good, would one this size run a 750l freshwater tropical setup?
What size pump would I need?
I have an Eheim 1048 (10l/min) and also a Rio 3100HD (3200l/hr)

Any other info/considerations?

Cheers all... :)
 

IanB

Member
Jul 21, 2011
370
0
16
Mid_Suffolk, UK
www.oldschoolmtb.co.uk
Right.. it's an Amiracle SR 200, 'Sea Reef' filter. Good for up to 180gallons.

Seems that bio-balls can give high nitrate, can this be counteracted?

I quite like the idea of getting heaters etc. out of the tank and it'd be a shame not to use this if it's a decent alternative to a canister.
 

D-MAC

Member
Jul 24, 2009
992
0
16
Lossiemouth
www.danditropicals.co.uk
Right.. it's an Amiracle SR 200, 'Sea Reef' filter. Good for up to 180gallons.

Seems that bio-balls can give high nitrate, can this be counteracted?

I quite like the idea of getting heaters etc. out of the tank and it'd be a shame not to use this if it's a decent alternative to a canister.
They can only give you nitrate if there is waste to convert...The reason you seem to have more N03 is because this type of filters are very aerobic with very little anaerobic bacteria to use up the nitrate's...I personally prefer a big external to sump filtration, but that's just my opinion :thumbup:
 

IanB

Member
Jul 21, 2011
370
0
16
Mid_Suffolk, UK
www.oldschoolmtb.co.uk
I've always used big externals, favouring Eheim - I dare say others have caught up in the last 15 years but, back then, imo there was nothing to touch 'em .. never used anything like this before..

Just wondering whether it's worth putting the effort (and minimal cash) to get this running (pump needs a new impeller, filter would need some sponge and whatever other media is best for f/water).. or should I just squirrel away whatever cash I can and buy a big ol' canister when I've got enough..
 

dw1305

Global Moderators
Staff member
May 5, 2009
1,396
0
36
Wiltshire nr. Bath, UK
Hi all,
I've always used big externals, favouring Eheim, I dare say others have caught up in the last 15 years
I still think the Eheim Classics are the best external filters, but I'd definitely keep and use the trickle filter.

Wet and dry trickle filters are probably the most efficient filters in terms bio-filtration, and their ability to fully oxygenate the water is absolutely ideal for rheophilic fish like Plecs.

Why Trickle filters are so good.

Because you have a thin film of water moving over the media in a trickle filter, it has a huge gas exchange surface (CO2 out, O2 in) and this means that the filter has the capability to convert large amounts of ammonia to nitrite and nitrate (You need 2 x O2 for every molecule of NH3 converted).

NH3 + CO2 + 1.5 O2 → NO2- + CO2 + 0.5 O2 → NO3-

Often what limits biological filtration capacity is amount of oxygen (O2) reaching the media. This is a particular problem with canister filters, when the filter is used to both syphon organic waste out of the tank and to biologically filter the water, as soon as flow speed and volume slackens biological filtration is compromised. Often the capacity of the filter is increased by removing some media from it, and replacing fine sponges etc with media like ceramic rings, which are difficult to clog.

I'm not familiar with this make of trickle filter, but I'd put a coarse sponge in an accessible place where you can clean it fairly frequently (pre-filter or protein skimmer box (you don't need the skimmer)) and then use alfagrog as my filter material in the filter tower (or the bio-balls if they came with the filter).

They can only give you nitrate if there is waste to convert...The reason you seem to have more N03 is because this type of filters are very aerobic with very little anaerobic bacteria to use up the nitrate's
As DMac says it is their huge bio-filtration capacity that can lead to NO3 building up, NO3 can only be removed in 3 ways.
  • By water changes
  • By the anaerobic bacterial conversion to N2 gas which out gases to the atmosphere.
  • or by being assimilated by plants.
Marine aquarists usually don't have any plants and need to keep nitrogen (and the other macronutrients) at very low levels. They often also need to keep water changes to a minimum, unless they have a ready source of clean sea water. To do this they use de-nitrifying coils, Jaubert plenums or deep mud filtration, all of which aim to out gas their N2 from an anaerobic environment. These are all quite difficult to run effectively.

In the fresh water aquarium it is much easier not to have any anaerobic conversion of NO3, and use plants and water changes to keep NO3 levels low.

There are more details here: <http://plecoplanet.com/?page_id=829>

cheers Darrel
 

IanB

Member
Jul 21, 2011
370
0
16
Mid_Suffolk, UK
www.oldschoolmtb.co.uk
VERY helpful, thanks.. :yes:

This is how I was thinking of working it..

Prefilter pad between the inlet and the drilled plate
A couple of sponge pads (in progressively finer 'mesh') after the drilled plate and before the bio-balls (which are already in there although it would seems that almost anything can be used, even toy soldiers - my Son would love this, an army looking after the tank :thumbup: )..
Couple of sponge pads between bio balls and the open space where the pump (and heaters) sit..

The inlet pipe (for inside the tank) has a couple of holes drilled at the very top, this would stop the syphon if the pump stopped working for whatever reason wouldn't it?

Would I need a tap on the outlet pipe from the pump to allow the flow to be restricted if it were too much for the outlet?

And (lastly for now.. sorry), would 3k litres per hour be too much to run through a spray bar (if I did this, it'd be a big'un) ?
 

dw1305

Global Moderators
Staff member
May 5, 2009
1,396
0
36
Wiltshire nr. Bath, UK
Hi all,
Prefilter pad between the inlet and the drilled plate A couple of sponge pads (in progressively finer 'mesh') after the drilled plate and before the bio-balls (which are already in there although it would seems that almost anything can be used, even toy soldiers - my Son would love this, an army looking after the tank ).. couple of sponge pads between bio balls and the open space where the pump (and heaters) sit.
I'd literally just use a coarse PPI10 block as a pre-filter, and bio-balls as your filter material. If you use a lot of fine floss or foam it will clog easily and lead to problems with the flow etc. You need to have a play with the media to make sure the return pump has the correct rating for the pipe size, head etc. There is a calculator here: <http://reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php>.

You could put a foam block on the entrance to the return pump, as well, if you are worried about fine sludge being pumped back. (looking at the picture I think it might have a slot for a foam built in between the bio-balls and the pump/heater)

I like the Kettering Koi 12" x 4" x 4" drilled foam blocks as sponge filters. You get a lot of foam for your money. You can also get cheap sponge sheets from Koi places, again I like the coarse PPI10 sheets.

I'm not to up on actual sump design, I used to have planted over-tank trickle filters in the lab, so it isn't something I've ever done. DMac may know more, or I'm sure you can get details from one of the marine types in the marine section. This link may tell you enough: <http://www.melevsreef.com/what_sump.html>

I'm also pretty sure if you don't mind a little bit of DIY, you can run the outlet via a spray bar rather than a weir, you may need more, bigger holes in the bar etc.

cheers Darrel
 

IanB

Member
Jul 21, 2011
370
0
16
Mid_Suffolk, UK
www.oldschoolmtb.co.uk
Thanks Darrel. Sorry I've not replied sooner, was waiting to grab some pics to (hopefully) properly explain what I've got (please try not to laugh.. I'm not very good at this :whistle: )

This is where the tank is drilled, the ID of the pipe is 1.75"



I'm guessing that water just overflows into that..

This is the pipe that I got to go inside the tank (the holes drilled at the top would prevent a syphon from emptying the tank should the pump fail I think? )



Inlet to the trickle filter, as standard I think it's joined to the tank outlet by a flexi pipe but googling suggests that solid would be better.. I also want the filter to sit under the right hand end of the tank so there'd be the 4' vertical from the tank and then almost 5' horizontal to the filter.. also houses the prefilter.. This would mean the return pipe would be pretty much straight up 4' to a shepherds crook into a spray bar (which I will probably custom make and have a total length of about 4.5')



Fairly standard tower section?.. as suggested, pond filter foam on top of bio-balls (or similar)



Where the pump and heaters sit.. there is a slot for a final pre-pump filter, is this where I'd add carbon or Purigen etc?
Could I put plants in here?



It's a bit minging and is getting a darn'd good clean soon..