light tube recomendations, OK to use tubes meant for shop lighting ?

[Pete]

Hi its time to change the fluorescent tubes again in the Rio 400
I have noticed that they are very expensive now, is it OK to use normal tubes meant for shop lighting ? they are £3 each rather than 20 and I have 2 tanks so it gets expensive!
I have found Triphosphor daylight tubes with a Lumen Output 3350 (36W T8 4ft ) would these be OK ?
I have been using 2 Sera brilliant daylights in the tanks which have mainly Java ferns low light plants, but have found they do best with a reasonable light level
Pete

 

[macvsog23]

You pay your money you take a choice
Standard Tubes are no going to produce light that will give plant growth of improve fish health but they will not kill the fish.
Strange how we see the cost of fish keeping
4 tubes = £80
Nike Trainers = £80

 

[bigbird]

Hello, My opnion is, I agree with Mac. You buy expensive Ls and do a great tank set up and then wish to save a little on light tubes. The choice in the end is yours, but I wud get rpoper aquarium tubes. cheers jk :thumbup:

 

[Irene0100]

ordianry tubes do not have the same range of wavelenghts as natural light, wheras the specialist light have a better spectrum range, thats why they cost more.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,
Pete, I can tell you that they will definitely be OK to use.

This makes me really angry and is a total con by the manufacturers of aquarium tubes, there are no "special phosphors" or anything else. I don't think any one minds paying top dollar for a good product, but this is a just taking advantage of people. The manufacturers know they can make all sorts of frankly laughable claims, because very few people have access to a PAR (Photosynthetically Active Radiation) meter. All the other values like K values, LUX or CRI are all to do with how we see the light and are irrelevant to plant growth.

The important bit is the PAR wavelengths used by the plants.

You can see that plants can actually utilise all the wavelengths from beyond visible in the UV to beyond visible in the infra-red, but with peaks in red and blue, and a trough in green. Green is reflected = plants are green. This means that the even the 3000K "soft white" tubes will supply some PAR, and the Cool White ones are also OK, but you will need a higher wattage because a lot of the light is "wasted". The red and blue peaks correspond to the absorbency of Chlorophyll a & b, but plants have other accessory pigments that capture much off the light that is outside of these wavelengths.

Any natural daylight 6500K tri-phosphor tube is absolutely perfect, these are the tubes labelled "860" or "865", if you prefer a bluer look the 10K SAD ones are fine as well. I buy all mine as the cheapest 6500K ones from "Lampspecs". <http://www.lampspecs.co.uk/Light-Bulbs-Tubes/860-and-865-Daylight_4>

Have a look at this web site to try and choose a look you like, these are T5's but the same colour rendering will occur with T8's. <http://www.jsctech.co.uk/theplantedtank/lighting.htm>

This is the "Osram Lumilux 880 Skywhite + Sylvania Grolux" image (below) from "James' Planted Tank" and it does look a very attractive mix with a high CRI.

cheers Darrel

 

[bigbird]

so we all learn more and more as we get older...thanks for that news....:clap:

 

[Pete]

Thanks everyone
Thanks Darrel for the great post thats very interesting
the 865 tubes look just the job , thanks for the link will order some
I have wondered before if there was something special about aquaruim tubes

I dont mind spending money on the plecs, they have got 4 filters in each tank and I use R/O water with the best minerals (Dennerle), its just cant afford to spend £80 for 4 tubes if I can get them for £2 each
How often do you change your tubes Darrel? I will be able to change them more often now:clap:
Pete

 

[Pete]

I have just ordered 8 4 foot 365 T8 tubes from lampspecs for £29 including post:woohoo:
The post was £7.50 because of the length of the tubes so thought might as well get a few:clap:

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

How often do you change your tubes Darrel? I will be able to change them more often now

This is the even better news, the modern electronically ballasted tri-phosphor T8's and T5's show hardly any fall off in light production, or change in wave length, before they fail (they don't flash on and off etc. they just stop working one day), so if they are good for 20,000 hours they will still be at about 95% efficiency at 20,000 hours. The technical term is low "Lamp Lumen Depreciation" <http://help.tradingdepot.co.uk/lighting/fluorescent-lamps.asp>. The reason for this is a combination of the phosphors used now, the gas fill and the "soft start" starter.

The older magnetically ballasted T8 fittings have a bit more of a drop off, but they should be all right for about 14,000 hours with a modern tube (the difference is caused by the starting method). If you are worried about whether the light is still good, the amount of dark colouration at the end of the tube is a good marker, once they have a noticeable dark ring or zone they are good for a change.

cheers Darrel

 

[macvsog23]

Fugging amazing
Mr D does it again
You sir are a wizz. Oh and Thanks for the bits the other day.

Regards Bob

 

[Pete]

Thanks Darrel
I have had the Rio 400,s for a few years now so would guess they are magnetically ballasted but changing them after 14,000 hours is no problem as they are only £2 or so each:clap:
Pete

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Rio 400,s for a few years now so would guess they are magnetically ballasted

If it is a big squarish chunky ballast it will be magnetic, the electronic ones are smaller and much thinner. Also with the magnetic ballast you have a starter (usually a white "button" on the side of the starter unit) and a capacitor (a silver cylinder), on the electronic ones it is just that the ballast.
Bob wrote

Thanks for the bits the other day

No problem at all, it was good to come and see the fish and fish-house in the flesh, just a shame I didn't have a bit longer.

cheers Darrel

 

[macvsog23]

Hi
Darrel said

"No problem it was good to come and see the fish and fish-house in the flesh."


Any one is welcome to visit
As I am going mad being off work A visit from any one is a break.

Off to SEA for 3 weeks soon so I cant wait.:clap:<3

Hope to get some photos of the local catfish as the locals eat them.:cry:
So expect photos of Wats and dead fish. :cry:

 

[Pete]

Thanks Darrel looking at it the ballast is an electronic one
thanks again for your help :clap:

 

[Pete]

Installed lights in both tanks looks great :clap:
pete

 

[Norman]

Intersting indeed. I always wondered about my 35G tank with cheapie tubes that my hubby insisted I purchase - the plants are doing better in this tank than my new 37G with the fancy LED lighting. Much better.

 

[juggy_85]

yeah im a sparky and the only time i've ever bought an aquarium tube is when i wanted a blue one they are harder to get but if you pay close attention to what your buying you will find the main difference is how they are advertised
as standard tubes are sold on a K rating while Aquarium one they try using a spectrum chart the biggest problem there is how many people can read one,
as for the K rating the low end is 2700K which is yellowish High End is 10000K which is a blue-white the closest to daylight is an 5400K which is luckily called daylight or natural depending on the brand also commonly coded as 854 the 8 is for the tube type ie; a T8 tube 54 is the colour ie; 5400k all are the same 865 etc hope this makes tube selection easier for everyone

 

[ccole]

hi guys really interesting thread- i was wondering about doing htis change myself but as i have gourmai's in my tank they often splash water on the bulbs jumping - would other lights be as water proof? cheers cole.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,
As long as you have water proof end caps (rated IP66 or IP67), occasional water splashing on the tubes themselves doesn't matter. Fluorescent tubes aren't like filament or discharge lamps, they run relatively cool and are unlikely to crack or craze. You need to try and avoid too much water splashing on the ballast unit, as they are only rated as IP44. I've got an aquarium fitting ("Hagen glo" twin 20W T8) and actinic fluorescent tubes on our moth trap, and this sits outside 365 days a year.

IP ratings here: <http://www.aquatext.com/tables/ip_ratings.htm>.

LED's are 12V and easy to water-proof so nearly all LED fittings will be IP66.

cheers Darrel

 

[ccole]

cheers darrel -