Well the floating plants that darrel sent me have been in the tank for just 1 day and all of them have new roots on them already..!
also put 1 small plant in the edge,to see how i gets on.
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staghorn again!!!
- Thread starter Tener ds
- Start date
also put 1 small plant in the edge,to see how i gets on.
Well I've been keeping a note about how fast these floating plants grow.
1 off them has roots on it that are just over an inch long.
The thing is it's only been in the tank 3 days and it didn't have any roots when I got it.
1 off them has roots on it that are just over an inch long.
The thing is it's only been in the tank 3 days and it didn't have any roots when I got it.
Hi all,
They will all grow really quickly if they have enough light and nutrients, they have access to aerial CO2, so this isn't a limiting factor. Your other plants are growing well, so that would indicate enough light and nutrients. Mine have all been nutrient (and particularly nitrogen - N) starved, but they should show a fairly quick response to more nitrogen in terms of both growth and greeness (chlorophyll is a protein, and therefore N rich).
cheers Darrel
They will all grow really quickly if they have enough light and nutrients, they have access to aerial CO2, so this isn't a limiting factor. Your other plants are growing well, so that would indicate enough light and nutrients. Mine have all been nutrient (and particularly nitrogen - N) starved, but they should show a fairly quick response to more nitrogen in terms of both growth and greeness (chlorophyll is a protein, and therefore N rich).
cheers Darrel
Well the little plants are loving my tank.
The root that I said was an inch long is now 2" long!!!
1 inch in a day.....
day 1:
day 3:
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i think im going to blame the ferts for the staghorn in my tank.
its back and im not happy.all fish are there,they get feed a very small amount 2x week, a 5% water change every 3 days with a 10% on mondays.
the co2 has not changed and the only thing i add is 1ml of ferts 2x a week,monday and friday.
any ideas??
apart from not useing ferts any more!
its back and im not happy.all fish are there,they get feed a very small amount 2x week, a 5% water change every 3 days with a 10% on mondays.
the co2 has not changed and the only thing i add is 1ml of ferts 2x a week,monday and friday.
any ideas??
apart from not useing ferts any more!
At the risk of sounding terribly monotonous.lol.
Increase the use of your ferts (micros + macros) and increase the CO2.
Seriously, try it. I had the worst outbreak of staghorn imaginable. It has long gone and will never be back.
Increase the use of your ferts (micros + macros) and increase the CO2.
Seriously, try it. I had the worst outbreak of staghorn imaginable. It has long gone and will never be back.
Ok, well I use jonhny70,s TFF ferts in my 75L. how much more should I add?
I add 2 ml a week, when I first had staghorn I was adding 5 ml a day,as the lable said,but stopped to get rid of the algae .from today I'm trying the lights out for 2 hours in the day method, just to see if it helps.
Cheers.
Hi all,
Dave, I have just looked back through this post, I think what you need is some stability. Because of this I would recommend taking off the worst effected leaves, but leaving everything else the same for a couple of months. At that point you can review your fish health, plant growth and algae and decide what you want to do.
CO2
As you ramp your CO2 up you increase the risk of stressing your fish through sub-lethal CO2 poisoning, this is due to the "Bohr Effect", where the higher CO2 levels lead to less full oxygenation of the blood. If you do raise your CO2 you need to make sure the water is fully oxygenated and your biological filtration running at its optimum capacity. During the day this is not a problem as enhanced CO2 will increase photosynthesis and O2 production, but when the plants aren't photosynthesising you need to drive off the excess CO2 as rapidly as possible (so probably run an air pump at night). The other problem with CO2 is that if you have a CO2 dump into the tank at the end of a cylinder etc. it will kill your fish.
Personally whatever the advantages are of CO2 for plant growth I won't use it because of the toxicity issues.
You also need to remember that your floating plants have the "aerial advantage", access to atmospheric CO2, and this means that levels of CO2 in the water are irrelevant to them.
Fertiliser
Again as you increase the levels of your ferts, (micros + macros), you definitely enhance plant growth (as long as CO2 or light aren't limiting), but you are adding more salts and nutrients to the water and this raises the potential for things to get out of balance, potentially leading to other algal and water quality problems.
I think of this like juggling, the more variables you add into the system, the more balls you have to juggle and the higher the level of light, CO2 and nutrients the higher those balls are thrown into the air.
Because of my lack of juggling ability I like to concentrate on retaining low levels of nutrients (using the "Duckweed index"), so that plant growth is nutrient limited. You can think of this as a low juggle with as fewer balls as possible.
The advantage of this "KISS (keep it simple stupid) approach" is that changes happen slowly and it gives you stability. The disadvantages are that the range of plants you can grow is limited, and because of the slow turn over of leaves, you always have some algae on the older leaves, usually BBA, Stags horn and a fine fuzz of green algae.
But I'd much rather have stability and algae, and that is my choice.
cheers Darrel
Dave, I have just looked back through this post, I think what you need is some stability. Because of this I would recommend taking off the worst effected leaves, but leaving everything else the same for a couple of months. At that point you can review your fish health, plant growth and algae and decide what you want to do.
This does work, you only need to look at Phoenix44's posts for definitive proof, but I'm convinced it is a method which increases the possibilities of things going wrong, and then you end up changing this, lowering that etc without really knowing where you are starting from.
CO2
As you ramp your CO2 up you increase the risk of stressing your fish through sub-lethal CO2 poisoning, this is due to the "Bohr Effect", where the higher CO2 levels lead to less full oxygenation of the blood. If you do raise your CO2 you need to make sure the water is fully oxygenated and your biological filtration running at its optimum capacity. During the day this is not a problem as enhanced CO2 will increase photosynthesis and O2 production, but when the plants aren't photosynthesising you need to drive off the excess CO2 as rapidly as possible (so probably run an air pump at night). The other problem with CO2 is that if you have a CO2 dump into the tank at the end of a cylinder etc. it will kill your fish.
Personally whatever the advantages are of CO2 for plant growth I won't use it because of the toxicity issues.
You also need to remember that your floating plants have the "aerial advantage", access to atmospheric CO2, and this means that levels of CO2 in the water are irrelevant to them.
Fertiliser
Again as you increase the levels of your ferts, (micros + macros), you definitely enhance plant growth (as long as CO2 or light aren't limiting), but you are adding more salts and nutrients to the water and this raises the potential for things to get out of balance, potentially leading to other algal and water quality problems.
I think of this like juggling, the more variables you add into the system, the more balls you have to juggle and the higher the level of light, CO2 and nutrients the higher those balls are thrown into the air.
Because of my lack of juggling ability I like to concentrate on retaining low levels of nutrients (using the "Duckweed index"), so that plant growth is nutrient limited. You can think of this as a low juggle with as fewer balls as possible.
The advantage of this "KISS (keep it simple stupid) approach" is that changes happen slowly and it gives you stability. The disadvantages are that the range of plants you can grow is limited, and because of the slow turn over of leaves, you always have some algae on the older leaves, usually BBA, Stags horn and a fine fuzz of green algae.
But I'd much rather have stability and algae, and that is my choice.
cheers Darrel
Hi all,
A lot of people run their high intensity light for relatively short photo-period (anything from 4 hours up) or use split photo-period to build up CO2 levels, but I look at as the sun is up for 12 hours a day, everyday, on the equator, so that should be about right for both plants and fish.
cheers Darrel
I don't think it will make any difference either way. I have my lights come on in the morning, and then off for a couple of hours around mid day and back on in the evening. This allows me to check the tank in the morning and means the lights are on when I'm home after work, but I only have a 9 hour photo period altogether. My tanks are in a light room, so they receive some natural day light anyway.
A lot of people run their high intensity light for relatively short photo-period (anything from 4 hours up) or use split photo-period to build up CO2 levels, but I look at as the sun is up for 12 hours a day, everyday, on the equator, so that should be about right for both plants and fish.
cheers Darrel
Ok, my lights come on at 12 and off at 7 pm. 7 hours only.
The missis said I'm to fussy. She said that all the tanks we have seen in fish shops etc
had some form off algae in them. She also said that I'll never have a algae free tank. Think she listens to me more than I do, lol.she also said that plants can be replaced, the fish I have can't. Haven't seen any more L081 or L134 for a long time.
So from now on I'll leave the tank alone and stop changing things.
The missis said I'm to fussy. She said that all the tanks we have seen in fish shops etc
had some form off algae in them. She also said that I'll never have a algae free tank. Think she listens to me more than I do, lol.she also said that plants can be replaced, the fish I have can't. Haven't seen any more L081 or L134 for a long time.
So from now on I'll leave the tank alone and stop changing things.
Hi all,
This is a tank belonging to Lukasz, a Polish Apistogramma breeder and the only submerged plants are red algae:
and this one just shows BBA in it's full beauty.
cheers Darrel
That's what I think as well, all natural waters have algae in them, it's just we don't like it in our tanks. You can do better than the shops for plants, you can add some nutrients, manipulate the light, do some gardening and have a healthy stable tank with plants (and some algae).
This is a tank belonging to Lukasz, a Polish Apistogramma breeder and the only submerged plants are red algae:
and this one just shows BBA in it's full beauty.
cheers Darrel
Lukasz tank looks nice.i think i might have some BBA,only a small bit growing on 1 of bits of bog wood.i have 5 bit of wood in the tank and it only grows on 1 of them.ive seen ned my L081 grazing on it.
hi,
well ive just done a head count in the big tank and im 1 otto down..:cry:
ive looked all over the tank,as much as i can ,and can,t find a body :wb:
so im waiting for the ammonia spike and more staghorn,o joy
well ive just done a head count in the big tank and im 1 otto down..:cry:
ive looked all over the tank,as much as i can ,and can,t find a body :wb:
so im waiting for the ammonia spike and more staghorn,o joy
well its back,not as much but its back.i,m starting to think its the ferts thats giving my tank staghorn.i can live with the tank having some but over the last 4 days its got worse,all the fish are there too.ive removed all the leaves that are coverd in it.
this is what im going to try from today,please say if there is anything else i can do:
change 5% water every 3 days,
on mondays do a 10%-12% water change and filter sponge clean,
i will be useing prime from next week,
add 2ml excel flourish per day,
fish get feed saturday and wednesday,only a small bit,it all goes within 2 mins,
and from today stop adding ferts.
the co2 has not change from when i installed it.
i do the same as above apart from adding ferts,2ml per day, and do a 5% water change every day.but i will start the above fom today.
also thinking about useing H202 to kill it,any thourghts on useing this stuff??
this is what im going to try from today,please say if there is anything else i can do:
change 5% water every 3 days,
on mondays do a 10%-12% water change and filter sponge clean,
i will be useing prime from next week,
add 2ml excel flourish per day,
fish get feed saturday and wednesday,only a small bit,it all goes within 2 mins,
and from today stop adding ferts.
the co2 has not change from when i installed it.
i do the same as above apart from adding ferts,2ml per day, and do a 5% water change every day.but i will start the above fom today.
also thinking about useing H202 to kill it,any thourghts on useing this stuff??
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I personaly would add Florish excel.I had terrible algae problems when I first set up my plant tank until I added excel now its totaly algae free.
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I just added the 5ml per 40 ltrs the first day followed by 5 ml per 200 ltr daily after that... Some sites I have looked at say to double the dose or higher, but I don't know how that would effect the livestock. One other item that has just become available here is Easy life algexit. Its believed to work very well.
thats a nice tank there,is there any fish in it?I personaly would add Florish excel.I had terrible algae problems when I first set up my plant tank until I added excel now its totaly algae free.